Wednesday, June 17, 2020
The Big Y DNA Test Reveal: R-FT111213
Nadene Goldfoot
The results of FTDNA's Big Y Test are that my maternal grandfather, Frank Hugh Robinson, and his father before him, Abiathar Smith Robinson of Vermont, were carrying the Y haplogroup of R1b1a2a1a1b4, which was later tested at a higher level to be R-L21, which at the Big Y level is now pronounced to be R-FT111213. Only one other male has tested this high and is the same match to my cousin whose surname is also Robinson. This is a Dyer, going back to a Ralph Dyer born in 1410 in Somerset, England. We have a genetic distance of 9.
As it turns out, another Dyer with the same name is also a 5th cousin, sharing DNA with my cousin who tested. The largest segment shared was on chromosome #6 amounting to 8.13cMs. Chromosomes 5, 6, (6), 7, 10, 11, 14, 14 also shared teeny amounts from 1.62 cMs to 3.11cMs. Our common ancestor's odds at 12 generations ago is 300 years and at 20 generations ago is 500 years, so between 300 to 500 years ago we had a common ancestor between the years of 1520 to 1720, we connected. Interestingly, both men testing; my cousin and the new Dyer, also had the mtDNA haplogroup of H. H did cover almost half of Europe.
Both of these two Y haplogroup matching men's results were the results from the Fitzpatrick DNA group who found we had some similar genes worth noting. This must mean that we have some Irish genes as well in these English Robinson genes. All along my grandfather's life, he thought his Robinsons came from Wales, as that's what he told us.
This information would be a wonderful birthday gift for my grandfather!
Our origins should then go back to Somerset, England with the Dyer line, as his findings go back that far. Somerset is a county in South West England which borders Gloucestershire and Bristol to the north, Wiltshire to the east, Dorset to the south-east and Devon to the south-west. It is bounded to the north and west by the Severn Estuary and the Bristol Channel, its coastline facing southeastern Wales. Well, Grandpa was close!
Robinson Family
Frank died in 1952 and Augusta in 1955
England has had many marriages of Robinson and Dyer. On LDS Family Search I found 20 on their first page. Example:
1. Edward Robinson m: Joane Dyer in 1608 in Andover, Hampshire, England.
2. Elinor Robinson m: John Dyer in 1715 in Worcester, Worchestershire, England.
Eight marriages since 1940 have taken place in Somerset, which is like a county to Americans, between Dyer and Robinson.
To reiterate, there are 2 Dyers matching our Robinson; one with the Y haplogroup test, and another in the familyfinder test. I do not know if they are related, but would think they are. And I thought I had big problems tracking the surname of Robinson!
Update: Noon: Our ggrandfather, Abiathar Smith Robinson, was married to Julia Ann Tuller b: 1834 who I found in Royalton, Windsor, Vermont on the 1850 census at age 15. I've also found a Jonathan Dyer b: 1771 in Massachusetts in Royalton since 1810 as well. He had a son, Ezra Dyer b: 1800 in Royalton. These Dyers do not connect to the Maine Dyers; at least not yet.
1 [1] JONATHAN DYER, Sr. b: 1771 in Braintree, Norfolk, Massachusetts d: February 24, 1862 in Royalton, Windsor, Vermont
.. +Betsy Bacon b: 1779 d: 1804 m: April 02, 1795
*2nd Wife of [1] JONATHAN DYER, Sr.:
.. +Loisa Adams b: Abt. 1785 in prob. Royalton, Windsor, Vermont d: January 26, 1848 in Royalton, Windsor, Vermont m: 1806
1 Marshall Lorenzo Dyer, Corporal b: January 13, 1846 in Brighton, Essex, Vermont/ Brookton Town, Washington, Maine d: August 21, 1923 in Island Pond, Essex, Vermont
.. +Adelaide G. Robinson b: July 06, 1848 in Charleston, Vermont d: February 16, 1885 in Island Pond, Essex, Vermont m: September 01, 1871 in Brighton, Essex, Vermont
Resource:
https://wwwrobinsongenealogy.blogspot.com/2020/04/robinson-dyer-connection.html
As it turns out, another Dyer with the same name is also a 5th cousin, sharing DNA with my cousin who tested. The largest segment shared was on chromosome #6 amounting to 8.13cMs. Chromosomes 5, 6, (6), 7, 10, 11, 14, 14 also shared teeny amounts from 1.62 cMs to 3.11cMs. Our common ancestor's odds at 12 generations ago is 300 years and at 20 generations ago is 500 years, so between 300 to 500 years ago we had a common ancestor between the years of 1520 to 1720, we connected. Interestingly, both men testing; my cousin and the new Dyer, also had the mtDNA haplogroup of H. H did cover almost half of Europe.
 |
| Frank Hugh Robinson b:June 21, 1870 |
Both of these two Y haplogroup matching men's results were the results from the Fitzpatrick DNA group who found we had some similar genes worth noting. This must mean that we have some Irish genes as well in these English Robinson genes. All along my grandfather's life, he thought his Robinsons came from Wales, as that's what he told us.
This information would be a wonderful birthday gift for my grandfather!
Robinson Family
Frank died in 1952 and Augusta in 1955
 |
| Center is Frank's wife, Augusta from Sweden and son Edward Kenneth and daughter Mildred Elizabeth. Ed died in 1988 and Mildred in 2005. |
1. Edward Robinson m: Joane Dyer in 1608 in Andover, Hampshire, England.
2. Elinor Robinson m: John Dyer in 1715 in Worcester, Worchestershire, England.
Eight marriages since 1940 have taken place in Somerset, which is like a county to Americans, between Dyer and Robinson.
To reiterate, there are 2 Dyers matching our Robinson; one with the Y haplogroup test, and another in the familyfinder test. I do not know if they are related, but would think they are. And I thought I had big problems tracking the surname of Robinson!
Update: Noon: Our ggrandfather, Abiathar Smith Robinson, was married to Julia Ann Tuller b: 1834 who I found in Royalton, Windsor, Vermont on the 1850 census at age 15. I've also found a Jonathan Dyer b: 1771 in Massachusetts in Royalton since 1810 as well. He had a son, Ezra Dyer b: 1800 in Royalton. These Dyers do not connect to the Maine Dyers; at least not yet.
1 [1] JONATHAN DYER, Sr. b: 1771 in Braintree, Norfolk, Massachusetts d: February 24, 1862 in Royalton, Windsor, Vermont
.. +Betsy Bacon b: 1779 d: 1804 m: April 02, 1795
*2nd Wife of [1] JONATHAN DYER, Sr.:
.. +Loisa Adams b: Abt. 1785 in prob. Royalton, Windsor, Vermont d: January 26, 1848 in Royalton, Windsor, Vermont m: 1806
1 Marshall Lorenzo Dyer, Corporal b: January 13, 1846 in Brighton, Essex, Vermont/ Brookton Town, Washington, Maine d: August 21, 1923 in Island Pond, Essex, Vermont
.. +Adelaide G. Robinson b: July 06, 1848 in Charleston, Vermont d: February 16, 1885 in Island Pond, Essex, Vermont m: September 01, 1871 in Brighton, Essex, Vermont
Resource:
https://wwwrobinsongenealogy.blogspot.com/2020/04/robinson-dyer-connection.html
Labels: dna, Dyer, England, R-FT111213, R-L21, Robinson, Somerset, Y haplogroup
Friday, February 28, 2020
Robinson Discovery of Irish Connection Bearing R-A1487 Y Haplogroup and the Normans
Nadene Goldfoot
My mother was Mildred Elizabeth Robinson and her father was Frank Hugh Robinson whose father was Abiathar Smith Robinson born in Vermont. I had my 1st cousin, Kenneth Robinson, tested with FTDNA for both the family finder and for his Y haplogroup.
He was found to be R1b1a2a1a1b4 originally and that has now become expanded into the big Y test from R-L21 to R-A1487. It was at the R-L21 stage that the Fitzpatrick group noticed his results and found that many many Fitzpatricks of Ireland matched his haplogroup and were also R-A1487s. They were so interested that they paid for my cousin's further test in the Big Y.
Sure enough, he belonged to their group, but with the name of Robinson! He was the only one. My grandfather, Frank, had told us all that he had run away from home as a boy because of an overly zealous father who wouldn't allow him to move his horse out of the field on a Sunday when a bull had managed to enter, threatening the horse. The horse was killed and my grandfather left, never to return. At age 16, he had left with a smattering of knowledge about his family.
He remembered that his family came from Wales. Information compiled in FTDNA show England and Ireland. They came over not on the MAYFLOWER of 1620 but the ship after that. The Robinson line shows that a John Robinson was the one who sent the Pilgrims of Holland on the Mayflower, though John stayed with his flock in Holland. It was his son, Isaac, who took the next ship over to America. According to my genealogy, that group of Robinsons had no record of having an Abiathar Smith Robinson in their line. They didn't seem to be in the right places to be a part of our family. However, none of them who were a part of the Robinson group online had done any DNA testing! Finding his origins seemed like an impossibility. The last place I thought of was Ireland or even Wales. He must have just been part of Robin Hood's family, whoever they were.
Robin Hood was a member of the Saxon nobility called Robin of Loxley. He fought at the crusades. On his return to England his lands had been taken by the Normans. ... Robin Hood the legend of Sherwood - He hides from the Normans as an outlaw in Sherwood Forest wearing clothes of Lincoln green.
The Normans had a profound effect on Irish culture and history after their invasion at Bannow Bay in 1169. Initially, the Normans maintained a distinct culture and ethnicity. Yet, with time, they came to be subsumed into Irish culture to the point that it has been said that they became "more Irish than the Irish themselves". The Normans settled mostly in an area in the east of Ireland, later known as the Pale, and also built many fine castles and settlements, including Trim Castle and Dublin Castle. Both cultures intermixed, borrowing from each other's language, culture and outlook. Norman descendants today can be recognised by their surnames. Names such as French, (De) Roche, Devereux, D'Arcy, Treacy and Lacy are particularly common in the southeast of Ireland, especially in the southern part of County Wexford, where the first Norman settlements were established. Other Norman names, such as Furlong, predominate there. Another common Norman-Irish name was Morell (Murrell), derived from the French Norman name Morel.
. Names beginning with Fitz (from the Norman for son) usually indicate Norman ancestry. Except for the native surname Fitzpatrick, a gallicisation of Mac Giolla Phádraig/Ó Maol Phádraig. Hiberno-Norman surnames with the prefix - 'fitz' include Fitzgerald, FitzGibbons (Gibbons) dynasty, Fitzmaurice. Families bearing such surnames as Barry (de Barra) and De Búrca (Burke) are also of Norman extraction. Well, this one Robinson is connected to the Fitzpatrick line! It also looks like we are connected to the Vikings this way, too.
Mark Robinson writes about the Normans
The Normans’ best-known achievement was their conquest of England. In 1066, William, the Duke of Normandy, disputed the claim of the new English king, Harold Godwinson. Soon after landing in England, William and his knights met Harold’s army near the town of Hastings. The climactic moment in the battle is immortalized in the 70-meter-long Bayeux Tapestry, where an arrow striking Harold in the eye seals the Norman victory. He became known as William the Conqueror. By the end of the 12th century, the Normans had further expanded into Wales, Scotland, and Ireland.
The Anglo Norman invasion of Ireland took place in stages during the late 12th century and led to the Anglo-Normans Kingdom of England conquering large swaths of land from the Irish. At the time, Gaelic Ireland was made up of several kingdoms, with a High King claiming lordship over the lesser kings.
From Dr. Michael Fitzpatrick:, update
Your shared ancestry with the A1488 Fitzpatricks is from around 900 AD. The historical narratives of the Fitzpatricks you match have them being in Ireland since ancient times, but DNA indicates there is simply no evidence of that.
Interestingly, Mary Therese Winifred Robinson is an Irish Independent politician who served as the seventh President of Ireland from December 1990 to September 1997, becoming the first woman to hold this office. This is her husband's surname as she was a Bourke from county Mayo.
Resource: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Normans
The phylogenealogy of R-L21, 4 1/2 millennia of expansion and redistribution by Joe Flood
 |
| Grandfather Frank Hugh Robinson b: June 21, 1870 in Wenona, Illinois d: May 27, 1952 in Hillsboro, Washington County, Oregon
He was tall and had blue eyes.
He could manage 4 horses at a time pulling a wagon. His 2nd wife was Augusta Gustafsson, a Swedish immigrant from Lumsheden, Sweden, obvious daughter of Swedish Vikings of long ago, as far back as the 800s.
|
He was found to be R1b1a2a1a1b4 originally and that has now become expanded into the big Y test from R-L21 to R-A1487. It was at the R-L21 stage that the Fitzpatrick group noticed his results and found that many many Fitzpatricks of Ireland matched his haplogroup and were also R-A1487s. They were so interested that they paid for my cousin's further test in the Big Y.
Sure enough, he belonged to their group, but with the name of Robinson! He was the only one. My grandfather, Frank, had told us all that he had run away from home as a boy because of an overly zealous father who wouldn't allow him to move his horse out of the field on a Sunday when a bull had managed to enter, threatening the horse. The horse was killed and my grandfather left, never to return. At age 16, he had left with a smattering of knowledge about his family.
He remembered that his family came from Wales. Information compiled in FTDNA show England and Ireland. They came over not on the MAYFLOWER of 1620 but the ship after that. The Robinson line shows that a John Robinson was the one who sent the Pilgrims of Holland on the Mayflower, though John stayed with his flock in Holland. It was his son, Isaac, who took the next ship over to America. According to my genealogy, that group of Robinsons had no record of having an Abiathar Smith Robinson in their line. They didn't seem to be in the right places to be a part of our family. However, none of them who were a part of the Robinson group online had done any DNA testing! Finding his origins seemed like an impossibility. The last place I thought of was Ireland or even Wales. He must have just been part of Robin Hood's family, whoever they were.
Robin Hood was a member of the Saxon nobility called Robin of Loxley. He fought at the crusades. On his return to England his lands had been taken by the Normans. ... Robin Hood the legend of Sherwood - He hides from the Normans as an outlaw in Sherwood Forest wearing clothes of Lincoln green.
They are an ethnic group that arose from contact between Norse Viking settlers of a region in France, named Normandy after them, and indigenous Franks and Gallo-Romans. The settlements in France followed a series of raids on the French coast from mainly Denmark, but also Norway, and Iceland, and they gained political legitimacy when the Viking leader Rollo agreed to swear fealty to King Charles III of West Francia. The distinct cultural and ethnic identity of the Normans emerged initially in the first half of the 10th century, and it continued to evolve over the succeeding centuries.
The Norman dynasty had a major political, cultural and military impact on medieval Europe and the Near East. The Normans were famed for their martial spirit and eventually for their Catholic piety, becoming exponents of the Catholic orthodoxy of the Romance community into which they assimilated.
The Normans had a profound effect on Irish culture and history after their invasion at Bannow Bay in 1169. Initially, the Normans maintained a distinct culture and ethnicity. Yet, with time, they came to be subsumed into Irish culture to the point that it has been said that they became "more Irish than the Irish themselves". The Normans settled mostly in an area in the east of Ireland, later known as the Pale, and also built many fine castles and settlements, including Trim Castle and Dublin Castle. Both cultures intermixed, borrowing from each other's language, culture and outlook. Norman descendants today can be recognised by their surnames. Names such as French, (De) Roche, Devereux, D'Arcy, Treacy and Lacy are particularly common in the southeast of Ireland, especially in the southern part of County Wexford, where the first Norman settlements were established. Other Norman names, such as Furlong, predominate there. Another common Norman-Irish name was Morell (Murrell), derived from the French Norman name Morel.
. Names beginning with Fitz (from the Norman for son) usually indicate Norman ancestry. Except for the native surname Fitzpatrick, a gallicisation of Mac Giolla Phádraig/Ó Maol Phádraig. Hiberno-Norman surnames with the prefix - 'fitz' include Fitzgerald, FitzGibbons (Gibbons) dynasty, Fitzmaurice. Families bearing such surnames as Barry (de Barra) and De Búrca (Burke) are also of Norman extraction. Well, this one Robinson is connected to the Fitzpatrick line! It also looks like we are connected to the Vikings this way, too.
Mark Robinson writes about the Normans
 |
| Son of Rollo the Viking who ruled Normandy is William the Conqueror He spoke a dialect of French |
The Normans’ best-known achievement was their conquest of England. In 1066, William, the Duke of Normandy, disputed the claim of the new English king, Harold Godwinson. Soon after landing in England, William and his knights met Harold’s army near the town of Hastings. The climactic moment in the battle is immortalized in the 70-meter-long Bayeux Tapestry, where an arrow striking Harold in the eye seals the Norman victory. He became known as William the Conqueror. By the end of the 12th century, the Normans had further expanded into Wales, Scotland, and Ireland.
The Anglo Norman invasion of Ireland took place in stages during the late 12th century and led to the Anglo-Normans Kingdom of England conquering large swaths of land from the Irish. At the time, Gaelic Ireland was made up of several kingdoms, with a High King claiming lordship over the lesser kings.
From Dr. Michael Fitzpatrick:, update
Your shared ancestry with the A1488 Fitzpatricks is from around 900 AD. The historical narratives of the Fitzpatricks you match have them being in Ireland since ancient times, but DNA indicates there is simply no evidence of that.
If the common ancestor was from Ireland you might expect to see other Irish matches from 900 AD and earlier other than Fitzpatricks. But you don't, which makes the idea an Irish man went to England and Wales not that convincing. What is convincing are the other English and Welsh (and Cambro-Norman) matches you have from from ca. 1300 AD and earlier.
And while the Vikings were in Ireland ca. 900 AD and earlier and did take Irish as slaves, there is no evidence of you or the A1488 Fitzpatricks having matches with Scandinavian surnames, nor is there any occurrence of your haplotypes (e.g., A1487, A1499 etc) being found in Scandinavian men. The Viking theory is a nice idea, but there's little to no DNA evidence for it. That doesn't mean there couldn't be in the future, however.
By far the simplest interpretation of your data, and your surname (son of Robert, Robert being introduced to Britain by Normans) for that matter, is that you are Norman in origin. That is supported by your DNA matches to D'Altons and FitzGeralds (some of the Brannan matches also trace to Wales, not Ireland). One FitzGerald match is even an ancestor from ca. 900-1000 AD, i.e, before Normans landed in Ireland. The FitzGeralds and their associates (who also took the FitzGerald name at times) were Cambro-Normans.
Update: A paper published in Acadamia also tells of the past 4,500 years bearing a change of this line of R-L21 that covers from the early Bronze age to the present in the English-Irish DNA line by Joe Flood. They were part of the Beaker-Atlantic culture. This redistribution of population took place over Ireland and Scotland since 100 BCE. The British with R-L21 goes back to 2500 BCE.
(https://mail.google.com/mail/u/0/?tab=wm#inbox/FMfcgxwHNgZGnWqRRBGhCSjzsjfxvJvX)
Update: A paper published in Acadamia also tells of the past 4,500 years bearing a change of this line of R-L21 that covers from the early Bronze age to the present in the English-Irish DNA line by Joe Flood. They were part of the Beaker-Atlantic culture. This redistribution of population took place over Ireland and Scotland since 100 BCE. The British with R-L21 goes back to 2500 BCE.
(https://mail.google.com/mail/u/0/?tab=wm#inbox/FMfcgxwHNgZGnWqRRBGhCSjzsjfxvJvX)
Interestingly, Mary Therese Winifred Robinson is an Irish Independent politician who served as the seventh President of Ireland from December 1990 to September 1997, becoming the first woman to hold this office. This is her husband's surname as she was a Bourke from county Mayo.
Resource: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Normans
The phylogenealogy of R-L21, 4 1/2 millennia of expansion and redistribution by Joe Flood
Labels: Fitzpatrick, Ireland, Normans, R-A1487, R-L21, Robinson genealogy, Vikings
Monday, January 29, 2018
Abiathar Smith Robinson's Father May have Been James Robinson From Tunbridge, Orange, Vermont
Nadene Goldfoot
Our ggrandfather, Abiathar Smith Robinson b: 1829, is not to be found anywhere to show who his parents were. It's as if he dropped out of the sky.
Orange, Vermont holds many of the towns that people moved around often.
Towns in Orange County:
Ancestry might have added more information since I last had used it in my Robinson searches, but it dawned on me that his father may have been from Tunbridge, Orange, Vermont because he and Julia Ann Tuller married there instead of Royalton, Vermont which is almost next door. Tunbridge is full of Julia's relatives as well; Tullers and her mother's people. The map shows that Tunbridge, Orange, Vermont and Royalton, Windsor, Vermont are right across from each other.
The only clue I've had to work with is that our cousin, Ken Robinson, took FTDNA's DNA tests, and his Y haplogroup is R-L21. Two other men match him and they are of the line that goes back to Meppershall, England which is through Rockingham, New Hampshire.
As you will see, James already has a child born in 1829, so Abiathar is out of place here, but that doesn't rule out some attachment, as a cousin. I'll look into that possibility of perhaps his father had died and he knew James as a place to stay with temporarily that didn't show up on a census.
Descendants of JAMES ROBINSON
1 JAMES ROBINSON b: Bet. June 16, 1800 - 1801 in Strafford, Orange, Vermont d: October 29, 1878 in Tunbridge, Orange, Vermont
.. +Mary Bicknell b: Bet. December 06, 1802 - 1803 in Chelsea, Orange, Vermont d: October 09, 1867 in Tunbridge, Orange, Vermont m: January 03, 1825
. 2 Mary Ann Robinson b: August 24, 1825 in Vermont d: February 09, 1894 in Tunbridge, Orange, Vermont
. 2 Martha T. Robinson b: September 23, 1827 in Vermont d: April 05, 1874 in prob. Tunbridge, Orange, Vermont
..... +Chas H. Perkins b: Abt. 1825
. 2 Charles Kent Robinson b: April 19, 1829 in Strafford, Orange, Vermont d: Aft. 1900 in Tunbridge, Orange, Vermont
. 2 [1] Abiathar Smith Robinson b: December 1829 in New York/ Tunbridge, Orange/ Jamaica, Windham, Vermont d: October 07, 1904 in Wenona, Marshall, Illinois
..... +Julia Ann Tuller b: December 18, 1834 in Royalton, Windsor, Vermont d: December 02, 1887 in Wenona, Marshall, Illinois m: February 29, 1852 in Tunbridge, Orange, Vermont by justice of the peace Alva Button
. *2nd Wife of [1] Abiathar Smith Robinson:
..... +Mary Jane Deffenbaugh Walters b: November 27, 1832 in Hocking County, Ohio d: July 05, 1918 in Streator, LaSalle, Illinois, age 85 m: 1896 in prob. Wenona, Illinois
. 2 James Trip Robinson b: April 06, 1831 in Strafford, Orange, Vermont d: July 03, 1897 in Tunbridge, Orange, Vermont
. 2 Alma Robinson b: November 04, 1833 in Vermont d: April 06, 1902 in Tunbridge, Orange, Vermont
..... +Seth Noyes b: 1822 d: 1899 m: April 09, 1862
. 2 Susan Robinson b: October 01, 1835 in Bradford, Orange, Vermont d: February 03, 1900 in Leominster, Massachusetts
..... +James Miller b: Abt. 1830 d: Bef. 1900
. 2 Mary Anne Robinson b: 1825 in Vermont
. 2 Martha T. Robinson b: 1828 in Vermont
. 2 Alma Robinson b: 1834 in Vermont
James Robinson , born June 16, 1800 in Strafford, Orange, Vermont, was living in Tunbridge in 1860 and 1870. He died there on October 29, 1878. Being there were other Robinsons there, too, I figure that the odds were pretty good that James was related to Abiathar, either as his father or perhaps an uncle or even a cousin. Mary Bicknell: December 6, 1802 in Chelsea, Orange, Vermont, was his wife. She died in Tunbridge, too.
James's father was David Robinson born in 1775 in Meredith, Belknap, New Hampshire. He died in West Fairlee, Orange, Vermont. His wife was listed as Marth Gripp, but it could have also been Tripp as the cursive letter looked more like a T than a G to me. Sometimes you wonder about these translators. T was turning out to be a popular initial in this group of people, too. There was a Tripp or Trip in my name bank already.
David, and I must say that I had zillions of David Robinsons in my name bank making this very difficult, had parents named Chase Robinson and Priscilla Pratt. Now this is leading to the DNA Y haplogroup match of James Robinson that my cousin Kenneth has who has traced his line to the same people. This line will go to Stratham, Rockingham, New Hampshire.
David's parents were Jonathan Robinson and Mary Mercy Chase in Exeter and Stratham, Rockingham, New Hampshire.
Jonathan's parents were John III Robinson and Mehitable Stanyan, still in Exeter, New Hampshire.
John's parents were Jonathan Robinson and Sarah Scribner in Haverhill and Exeter, New Hampshire. John was born in 1645.
Jonathan's parents were John Robinson Sr. and Elizabeth Trickley. John sailed from Meppershall, Bedfordshire, England and died in Exeter, Rockingham, New Hampshire on September 10, 1675
Considering that the Mayflower had sailed in 1620, that isn't much after the following armada of ships that returned to Massachusetts in 1630. Our oral history had said that our ancestors came over on a ship after the Mayflower.
Abiathar's Y haplogroup is found by his great grandson, Ken Robinson and is R-L21. It was originally labeled as R1b1a2a1a1b4. So it was an R1b and the origin seems to be the British Isles with the 393 allele being a 12 and not a 13 which shows a more Irish origin.
Getting back to Ken's Y haplogroup and match with James and Richard Robinson, it is R-L21.
Richard is R-M269 and James is R-FGC5511. All come from R1b1a2 before updating and being given new tags. There are only 3 people with this haplogroup bearing the surname of Robinson.
Richard Robinson at 24 generations ago would have a 99.67% chance of sharing a common ancestor.
James Robinson at 24 generations ago would have a 99.92 % chance of sharing a common ancestor.
It is so difficult to follow Robinsons from one generation to another. One must use the census carefully as there are common first names used by everyone. Any information before the 1850 census is iffy. Family trees help if they relied on actual family records recorded in their bibles or something similar. That's what I used to get started, my grandmother's Swedish Bible with a family tree recorded. I've used ancestry.com for all my searches and the LDS website, Family Search, occasionally.
Resource: http://wwwrobinsongenealogy.blogspot.com/2014/11/john-robinson-born-1611-in-meppershall.html
http://wwwrobinsongenealogy.blogspot.com/2015/11/connecting-to-king-james-ii-and-his.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic_history_of_the_British_Isles
https://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplogroup_R1b_Y-DNA.shtml
https://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplogroup_R1b_Y-DNA.shtml#famous_people
http://wwwrobinsongenealogy.blogspot.com/2012/01/famous-people-on-our-robinson-tree.html
https://www.blogger.com/blogger.g?blogID=8841494#editor/target=post;postID=8221628733317689106;onPublishedMenu=allposts;onClosedMenu=allposts;postNum=67;src=postname
http://wwwrobinsongenealogy.blogspot.com/2011/07/matching-house-of-stuart-royalty.html
.
 |
| TUNBRIDGE, ORANGE, VERMONT Farming was the occupation of men in those days |
Orange, Vermont holds many of the towns that people moved around often.
Towns in Orange County:
| Bradford Braintree Brookfield Chelsea Corinth | Fairlee Newbury Orange Randolph | Strafford Thetford Topsham Tunbridge | Vershire Washington West Fairlee Williamstown |
The only clue I've had to work with is that our cousin, Ken Robinson, took FTDNA's DNA tests, and his Y haplogroup is R-L21. Two other men match him and they are of the line that goes back to Meppershall, England which is through Rockingham, New Hampshire.
As you will see, James already has a child born in 1829, so Abiathar is out of place here, but that doesn't rule out some attachment, as a cousin. I'll look into that possibility of perhaps his father had died and he knew James as a place to stay with temporarily that didn't show up on a census.
Descendants of JAMES ROBINSON
1 JAMES ROBINSON b: Bet. June 16, 1800 - 1801 in Strafford, Orange, Vermont d: October 29, 1878 in Tunbridge, Orange, Vermont
.. +Mary Bicknell b: Bet. December 06, 1802 - 1803 in Chelsea, Orange, Vermont d: October 09, 1867 in Tunbridge, Orange, Vermont m: January 03, 1825
. 2 Mary Ann Robinson b: August 24, 1825 in Vermont d: February 09, 1894 in Tunbridge, Orange, Vermont
. 2 Martha T. Robinson b: September 23, 1827 in Vermont d: April 05, 1874 in prob. Tunbridge, Orange, Vermont
..... +Chas H. Perkins b: Abt. 1825
. 2 Charles Kent Robinson b: April 19, 1829 in Strafford, Orange, Vermont d: Aft. 1900 in Tunbridge, Orange, Vermont
. 2 [1] Abiathar Smith Robinson b: December 1829 in New York/ Tunbridge, Orange/ Jamaica, Windham, Vermont d: October 07, 1904 in Wenona, Marshall, Illinois
..... +Julia Ann Tuller b: December 18, 1834 in Royalton, Windsor, Vermont d: December 02, 1887 in Wenona, Marshall, Illinois m: February 29, 1852 in Tunbridge, Orange, Vermont by justice of the peace Alva Button
. *2nd Wife of [1] Abiathar Smith Robinson:
..... +Mary Jane Deffenbaugh Walters b: November 27, 1832 in Hocking County, Ohio d: July 05, 1918 in Streator, LaSalle, Illinois, age 85 m: 1896 in prob. Wenona, Illinois
. 2 James Trip Robinson b: April 06, 1831 in Strafford, Orange, Vermont d: July 03, 1897 in Tunbridge, Orange, Vermont
. 2 Alma Robinson b: November 04, 1833 in Vermont d: April 06, 1902 in Tunbridge, Orange, Vermont
..... +Seth Noyes b: 1822 d: 1899 m: April 09, 1862
. 2 Susan Robinson b: October 01, 1835 in Bradford, Orange, Vermont d: February 03, 1900 in Leominster, Massachusetts
..... +James Miller b: Abt. 1830 d: Bef. 1900
. 2 Mary Anne Robinson b: 1825 in Vermont
. 2 Martha T. Robinson b: 1828 in Vermont
. 2 Alma Robinson b: 1834 in Vermont
James Robinson , born June 16, 1800 in Strafford, Orange, Vermont, was living in Tunbridge in 1860 and 1870. He died there on October 29, 1878. Being there were other Robinsons there, too, I figure that the odds were pretty good that James was related to Abiathar, either as his father or perhaps an uncle or even a cousin. Mary Bicknell: December 6, 1802 in Chelsea, Orange, Vermont, was his wife. She died in Tunbridge, too.
David, and I must say that I had zillions of David Robinsons in my name bank making this very difficult, had parents named Chase Robinson and Priscilla Pratt. Now this is leading to the DNA Y haplogroup match of James Robinson that my cousin Kenneth has who has traced his line to the same people. This line will go to Stratham, Rockingham, New Hampshire.
 |
| Exeter, Rockingham, New Hampshire today |
Jonathan's parents were John III Robinson and Mehitable Stanyan, still in Exeter, New Hampshire.
John's parents were Jonathan Robinson and Sarah Scribner in Haverhill and Exeter, New Hampshire. John was born in 1645.
Jonathan's parents were John Robinson Sr. and Elizabeth Trickley. John sailed from Meppershall, Bedfordshire, England and died in Exeter, Rockingham, New Hampshire on September 10, 1675
Considering that the Mayflower had sailed in 1620, that isn't much after the following armada of ships that returned to Massachusetts in 1630. Our oral history had said that our ancestors came over on a ship after the Mayflower.
Abiathar's Y haplogroup is found by his great grandson, Ken Robinson and is R-L21. It was originally labeled as R1b1a2a1a1b4. So it was an R1b and the origin seems to be the British Isles with the 393 allele being a 12 and not a 13 which shows a more Irish origin.
Richard is R-M269 and James is R-FGC5511. All come from R1b1a2 before updating and being given new tags. There are only 3 people with this haplogroup bearing the surname of Robinson.
Richard Robinson at 24 generations ago would have a 99.67% chance of sharing a common ancestor.
James Robinson at 24 generations ago would have a 99.92 % chance of sharing a common ancestor.
It is so difficult to follow Robinsons from one generation to another. One must use the census carefully as there are common first names used by everyone. Any information before the 1850 census is iffy. Family trees help if they relied on actual family records recorded in their bibles or something similar. That's what I used to get started, my grandmother's Swedish Bible with a family tree recorded. I've used ancestry.com for all my searches and the LDS website, Family Search, occasionally.
According to the Stewart Stuart DNA Project House of Stuart, who ruled Scotland from 1371, then also England and Ireland from 1603 until 1707, belongs to the S781 branch of R1b-L21, downstream of DF13 and L744.
Grover Cleveland (1837-1908), the 22nd and 24th president of the United States, could have belonged to R1b-L20, a subclade of L2, based on the numerous results from the Cleveland DNA Project.
This is pretty amazing because I had discovered through Abiathar's wife, Julia Ann Tuller, that her ancestor connects to the kings and Grover Cleveland in one of my theories as to who our gggrandfather was. .
Resource: http://wwwrobinsongenealogy.blogspot.com/2014/11/john-robinson-born-1611-in-meppershall.html
http://wwwrobinsongenealogy.blogspot.com/2015/11/connecting-to-king-james-ii-and-his.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic_history_of_the_British_Isles
https://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplogroup_R1b_Y-DNA.shtml
https://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplogroup_R1b_Y-DNA.shtml#famous_people
http://wwwrobinsongenealogy.blogspot.com/2012/01/famous-people-on-our-robinson-tree.html
https://www.blogger.com/blogger.g?blogID=8841494#editor/target=post;postID=8221628733317689106;onPublishedMenu=allposts;onClosedMenu=allposts;postNum=67;src=postname
http://wwwrobinsongenealogy.blogspot.com/2011/07/matching-house-of-stuart-royalty.html
.
Labels: England, Meppershall, New Hampshire, Orange, R-L21, Robinson, Tunbridge, Vermont Rockingham
Wednesday, November 19, 2014
Our Robinson Family Matching Irish DNA
Nadene Goldfoot
A new fact I have just been introduced to is that the British got rid of their political prisoners by shipping them all over to the new world during the same period my ancestor was reported to have come over. Our DNA matches a good 20 Irish people on Family Tree DNA. Our allele #393 is a 12. This is rare in the R1b grouping. It seems to be pointing to the Irish, all right.
The history is that the Irish came over as actual slaves! Some may want to call them indentured servants, but "from the 17th and 18th centuries, Irish slaves were nothing more than human cattle." They were shipped by the hundreds of thousands. Men, women and tiny children were sent out of Britain to America.
When they rebelled or disobeyed an order, they were harshly punished. Slave owners would hang them by their hands and then set their hands or feet on fire as a punishment. They were burned alive. Their heads were stuck on pikes in the marketplace as a warning to other captives.
It was King James II and Charles I that led their people to make slaves out of the Irish. Oliver Cromwell dehumanized these people who lived right next door to them. King James II sold 30,000 Irish prisoners as slaves to the New World. It was his Proclamation of 1625 that required Irish political prisoners to be sent oversees and sold to English settlers in the West Indies. By the mid 1600's, the Irish were the main slaves sold in Antigua and Montserrat. Then 70% of their population were Irish slaves.
From 1641 to 1652, over 500,000 Irish were killed by the English. Another 300,000 were sold as slaves. Ireland's population fell from about 1,500,000 to 600,000 in one decade. Britain didn't allow the fathers to take their wives and children with them, leaving homeless women and children in Britain so their solution was to auction them off as well.
During the 1650's, over 100,000 Irish children between the ages of 10-14 were taken from their parents and sold not only in the West Indies but also to Virginia and New England. Pictured here is a British slave ship.
Black slaves were competitors, meaning the owners selling them were competing with each other. They were more expensive to buy and so often treated better than the Irish slaves. In the early 1600's Black slaves cost 50 Sterling. Irish were no more than 5 Sterling. It was not a crime to beat one to death.. The Irish masters began breeding the Irish women for both their own pleasure and better profit. If a woman was able to buy her freedom, her children were still slaves and could not leave with her, so the mothers would remain as slaves.
The next way to get more profits was to breed the Irish women even as young as 12 with the Black men. These mulatto slaves cost more. This went on for several decades. In 1681, legislation was passed "forbidding the practice of mating Irish slave women to African slave men to make slaves for sale. It was passed because this practice was interfering with the profits of a large slave transport company.
England had shipped tens of thousands of Irish slaves for over a century. After the 1798 Irish Rebellion, thousands were sold to America and Australia and all slaves were being abused. One British ship dumped 1,302 slaves into the Atlantic Ocean so the crew could have enough food to eat.
Is this the way our Robinson ancestor came over? Is it possible he, with all the matching Irish genes, was not a British Puritan?
Somehow, Britain in 1839 finally ended transporting slaves. English pirates did continue as they did as they wanted.
From what I've read, most slaves went to the Islands to slave in the sugar plantations, or to the southern part of the USA in Virginia. I don't think as many went to New England but some did.
One of the Robinsons in the USA whose ancestor was John, born in South Carolina, did "Migration to America-England, Scotland, Ireland, America, from Robinson Roundup which I am reading. Their ancestors were also Scotch-Irish, but originated in England. Later, they had migrated to Scotland and then migrated later to northern Ireland in 1610 because King James I of England offered a colony of Scottish Protestant Lowlanders free land in Ulster, Ireland. It was later confiscated from the native Irish Catholics because of their bitter hostility towards the British Crown. King James wanted to establish a colony of people with strong loyalty for the English. The Scottish Lowlanders had intense racial pride and would not intermarry with the Irish. They also were the most uncompromising of Protestants and would not convert to Catholicism.
Between 1610 and 1620, 40,000 Scotch Presbyterians were settled in Ulster, Ireland. New laws passed in Ireland caused the Scotch-Irish immigration to America which didn't start until 1718. My Robinson's, according to my grandfather's oral history, were supposed to have come over after the Mayflower ship sailed in 1620, which could have been on one of the ships in the 1630 fleet, or even before that between 1620-1630. It's most possible, though, that they were of English origins that had migrated to Ireland. He had dropped out of school when he ran away from home at age 16-18, so I don't think he learned this in school. More likely it had been something he heard in his family. He was born in 1870.
Robinson has been found in records to be spelled as Roberson, as it was for mine in a few places. That's easy as the e and r could be miswritten for the i and n in cursive writing. Also, it's been seen as Robson, Robeson, and Robertson. In 1790 in the USA there were the 37th most popular surname. 4,652 Robinsons were counted. Now it's about 22nd with 435,000 adult Robinsons in America. No wonder I'm having a hard time finding our great great grandfather, the father of Abiathar Smith Robinson born December 1829 possibly in Vermont or New York.
In England, Robinsons had come from Bart, Berks, Cheshire, Oxford, Durham, Middlesex, Stafford, Tottenham, Lincoln, Northcumberland, Kentwall, Hall, Suffolk, York, Leicester and London and of course in Scotland and Ireland as well. I also found that my DNA match had traced his family to Meppershall, Bedfordshire, England, so they came from where they had last lived.
We belong to the R-L21 and Subclades on FamilyTreeDNA. I looked at the colored Project Y-DNA results under the group of R-L21 which is a chart of all the alleles of all the people, and I counted 28 people starting with #393 allele as a 12. There are only two of us with the surname of Robinson, and we have a distance of 5, matching most all our alleles more than with anyone else. I saw a few others listing Ireland as their origin.
Resource: http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-irish-slave-trade-the-forgotten-white-slaves/31076
http://www.raceandhistory.com/cgi-bin/forum/webbbs_config.pl?md=read;id=1638
http://www.robinsonroundup.com/book/Chapter1.pdf
http://www.landofthebrave.info/indentured-servants.htm
A new fact I have just been introduced to is that the British got rid of their political prisoners by shipping them all over to the new world during the same period my ancestor was reported to have come over. Our DNA matches a good 20 Irish people on Family Tree DNA. Our allele #393 is a 12. This is rare in the R1b grouping. It seems to be pointing to the Irish, all right.
When they rebelled or disobeyed an order, they were harshly punished. Slave owners would hang them by their hands and then set their hands or feet on fire as a punishment. They were burned alive. Their heads were stuck on pikes in the marketplace as a warning to other captives.
From 1641 to 1652, over 500,000 Irish were killed by the English. Another 300,000 were sold as slaves. Ireland's population fell from about 1,500,000 to 600,000 in one decade. Britain didn't allow the fathers to take their wives and children with them, leaving homeless women and children in Britain so their solution was to auction them off as well.
Black slaves were competitors, meaning the owners selling them were competing with each other. They were more expensive to buy and so often treated better than the Irish slaves. In the early 1600's Black slaves cost 50 Sterling. Irish were no more than 5 Sterling. It was not a crime to beat one to death.. The Irish masters began breeding the Irish women for both their own pleasure and better profit. If a woman was able to buy her freedom, her children were still slaves and could not leave with her, so the mothers would remain as slaves.
The next way to get more profits was to breed the Irish women even as young as 12 with the Black men. These mulatto slaves cost more. This went on for several decades. In 1681, legislation was passed "forbidding the practice of mating Irish slave women to African slave men to make slaves for sale. It was passed because this practice was interfering with the profits of a large slave transport company.
England had shipped tens of thousands of Irish slaves for over a century. After the 1798 Irish Rebellion, thousands were sold to America and Australia and all slaves were being abused. One British ship dumped 1,302 slaves into the Atlantic Ocean so the crew could have enough food to eat.
Is this the way our Robinson ancestor came over? Is it possible he, with all the matching Irish genes, was not a British Puritan?
Somehow, Britain in 1839 finally ended transporting slaves. English pirates did continue as they did as they wanted.
From what I've read, most slaves went to the Islands to slave in the sugar plantations, or to the southern part of the USA in Virginia. I don't think as many went to New England but some did.
One of the Robinsons in the USA whose ancestor was John, born in South Carolina, did "Migration to America-England, Scotland, Ireland, America, from Robinson Roundup which I am reading. Their ancestors were also Scotch-Irish, but originated in England. Later, they had migrated to Scotland and then migrated later to northern Ireland in 1610 because King James I of England offered a colony of Scottish Protestant Lowlanders free land in Ulster, Ireland. It was later confiscated from the native Irish Catholics because of their bitter hostility towards the British Crown. King James wanted to establish a colony of people with strong loyalty for the English. The Scottish Lowlanders had intense racial pride and would not intermarry with the Irish. They also were the most uncompromising of Protestants and would not convert to Catholicism.
Between 1610 and 1620, 40,000 Scotch Presbyterians were settled in Ulster, Ireland. New laws passed in Ireland caused the Scotch-Irish immigration to America which didn't start until 1718. My Robinson's, according to my grandfather's oral history, were supposed to have come over after the Mayflower ship sailed in 1620, which could have been on one of the ships in the 1630 fleet, or even before that between 1620-1630. It's most possible, though, that they were of English origins that had migrated to Ireland. He had dropped out of school when he ran away from home at age 16-18, so I don't think he learned this in school. More likely it had been something he heard in his family. He was born in 1870.
Robinson has been found in records to be spelled as Roberson, as it was for mine in a few places. That's easy as the e and r could be miswritten for the i and n in cursive writing. Also, it's been seen as Robson, Robeson, and Robertson. In 1790 in the USA there were the 37th most popular surname. 4,652 Robinsons were counted. Now it's about 22nd with 435,000 adult Robinsons in America. No wonder I'm having a hard time finding our great great grandfather, the father of Abiathar Smith Robinson born December 1829 possibly in Vermont or New York.
In England, Robinsons had come from Bart, Berks, Cheshire, Oxford, Durham, Middlesex, Stafford, Tottenham, Lincoln, Northcumberland, Kentwall, Hall, Suffolk, York, Leicester and London and of course in Scotland and Ireland as well. I also found that my DNA match had traced his family to Meppershall, Bedfordshire, England, so they came from where they had last lived.
Resource: http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-irish-slave-trade-the-forgotten-white-slaves/31076
http://www.raceandhistory.com/cgi-bin/forum/webbbs_config.pl?md=read;id=1638
http://www.robinsonroundup.com/book/Chapter1.pdf
http://www.landofthebrave.info/indentured-servants.htm
Labels: #393 alele=12, after Mayflower, dna, Irish origins, King James II, New England, Puritans, R-L21, slave ships, Vermont
